Updating RA Official Map Pool

Official map pool has not been updated for a few years, and I think it's time to start rotating it once again

Discussion about the game and its default mods.
lawANDorder
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by lawANDorder »

I'd like to keep Mad Science and Puddles Redux. Nod Castle needs its cliffs fixed before adding, although I'm not a fan of this map or Anal Gardens because of poor aesthetics. The latter should be renamed because the author name is usually not included in the map name.

I'd like to see one of the Archipelago variations being added. Europe mission map should probably be replaced with its conquest equivalent.

FWIW, there is also a singleplayer audience and map balance although desireable is not nessecarily mandatory. Remove Poland Raid because bots don't work on it.

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netnazgul
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by netnazgul »

As the latest person to update the official map pool, I guess I should note, that there are two important points that should be considered and that will likely invalidate a lot of (seemingly good) intentions above:
1. You can't increase the map count to infinity, because it is made a part of distributive, and contrary to the common opinion of "internet is faster than ever" noone will like to download hundreds of megabytes of RA mod maps, as it is, let's be frank, a deadweight for a lot of people, cause everyone plays custom maps anyway, and then RA mod is only one of the three there.
2. Yes, a lot of maps might seem to be inferior, but they are liked by a lot of people, and I still see games on those maps in lobbies. Not everyone needs a perfectly balanced huge "serious competitive" map to play a couple of games with friends or even against AI. There is that elusive "thousands of offline players" argument in the air, but I remember at least several posts under news posts about certain maps to be removed from the official pool.

I think it would be best to allow Resource Center overhaul happen first (this is underway as far as I'm aware), and then to revise the very concept of a mod map pool. I.e. stripping it down to bare minimum and implementing "editor's choice packs" or something that is downloadable directly from client in one click. We already have a lot of work put into this, with WhoCares' map packs or author's map packs by SuperNewbie and Lad, for example. I'm sure, custom rules modifications or casual FFA packs will also be made by someone in this style.

spetsnaz84
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by spetsnaz84 »

Add:
  • * Discovery
    * Stanitsa
    * Forgotten Plains
Keep:
  • * Agenda
    * Desert Rats
    * Dual Cold front
    * Green Belt
    * Keep Off the Grass 2
    * Sidestep
    * Warwind
    * Barracuda
    * Sunstroke
    * Doublestep
    * Mad Science (but remove the biolab)
    * Minor Pressure
    * Puddles Redux
    * Tournament Island
    * Poland Raid

Mees
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2019 2:49 pm

Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by Mees »

netnazgul wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 3:41 pm
As the latest person to update the official map pool, I guess I should note, that there are two important points that should be considered and that will likely invalidate a lot of (seemingly good) intentions above:
1. You can't increase the map count to infinity, because it is made a part of distributive, and contrary to the common opinion of "internet is faster than ever" noone will like to download hundreds of megabytes of RA mod maps, as it is, let's be frank, a deadweight for a lot of people, cause everyone plays custom maps anyway, and then RA mod is only one of the three there.
2. Yes, a lot of maps might seem to be inferior, but they are liked by a lot of people, and I still see games on those maps in lobbies. Not everyone needs a perfectly balanced huge "serious competitive" map to play a couple of games with friends or even against AI. There is that elusive "thousands of offline players" argument in the air, but I remember at least several posts under news posts about certain maps to be removed from the official pool.

I think it would be best to allow Resource Center overhaul happen first (this is underway as far as I'm aware), and then to revise the very concept of a mod map pool. I.e. stripping it down to bare minimum and implementing "editor's choice packs" or something that is downloadable directly from client in one click. We already have a lot of work put into this, with WhoCares' map packs or author's map packs by SuperNewbie and Lad, for example. I'm sure, custom rules modifications or casual FFA packs will also be made by someone in this style.
Agreed to every word.

If we add a certain amount of Maps that are Popular now, we end up overhauling the official map pool every year.

Perhaps in the future a feature could be added with most played maps In a day/week/month/year, or per category

i like men
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by i like men »

Just to follow up on what I said on discord a couple of days ago:

I would be very careful with removing maps as it essentially removes content from singleplayer players and the rest of us rarely play the official maps anyway.
I think it makes sense to add some new maps but as Anjew mentioned there probably has to be a limit to how many maps there should be. The impression I got was that we have not reached this "limit" yet, in which case I think it makes perfectly sense to add some more maps.

As for the maps I think there have been a lot of good suggestions here, but just to give my own list:

Discovery
Forgotten Plains
Marigold Town (perhaps 2v2 and/or 3v3 version as well)
Shadowfiend II

Code 19 (3 player FFA map)

Chernobyl (perhaps 3v3 version as well)
Collaboration
Pitiless
Ridges

Dusttown Battle
Progress
Replace Union Sacreé with Union Nationale

Altercation
Forward Progress

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Upps
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by Upps »

I agree with Amhols list too. Further we should take a look on the symetry and tile errors! Its known that some of the maps have really poor tile errors and others some small issues. They need all to be 100% accurate! Its the offical map pool and the first contact for every player with the game.

Another problem is that probably all which reply to this post prefer ERCC and we know their is some conflict potential!

lawANDorder
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by lawANDorder »

Upps wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:15 pm
Another problem is that probably all which reply to this post prefer ERCC and we know their is some conflict potential!
The custom rules and assets can easily be removed from maps that currently don't have a version with default rules.

abcdefg30
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by abcdefg30 »

Kotg is a remasters map as well in the ladder, so I'd keep Keep of the Grass 2.
I don't like A Path Beyond, but we should likely keep it for the same reason.

Although not really competitive I like the visuals and variety (compared to the very similar competitive maps) on:

Code: Select all

Polar Disorder
Siberian Pass
Orelord
Mad Science
Tandem (don't like that map personally)
Temperal
Similarly, consider keeping Singles and Doubles since the "more modern" maps aren't built like that.
If we can find some better replacements for any of the above I wouldn't mind removing them much.

I don't mind removing:

Code: Select all

Northwest Passage
Winter Storm
Poland Raid (should have been removed before)
Pitfight (ugly af)
Snow Off
Barracuda
Icy Ridge
Climax
Decrepit Isles
East vs West
Puddles Redux
Tabula Rasa
Vihaan Lunta
Cold Front (we have the dual version)
Encounter
Opposite Force
Six Below Zero
Vegetation
Rapa Nui
Unconventional Warfare
All Connected
Caffeinated
Centre of Attention Redux
Coastal Influence
Countercross (might want to find a replacement for that)
North by Northwest
Regeneration Basin
Hypothermia
Alaska Anarchy Redux
Engagement
Tainted Peak
Mass Confliction
We should get a better replacement for (or keep otherwise):

Code: Select all

Two 3 player ffa maps (Barracuda, Icy Ridge removed)
A new 5 player ffa map (we only have a single map)
One more 3v3 map (Encounter, Opposing Force, Cold Front, Six Below Zero removed)
A new 7 player ffa map (Unconventional Warfare removed)
Find another 3v3v3 map (Hypothermia removed)
Another 5v5 map (Engagement, Tainted Peak removed)
A new 6v6 map (Mass Confliction removed)
Generally I'd like to reduce the huge map pool a bit.

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Wippie
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by Wippie »

Maps I would like to stay in and on Abcdefgs list:
Climax.

Last to come in, loads of positive feedback and had > 20 revisions, sketchy versions floating around.

I think a Europe version should be in Official. There are many sketchy versions but also some great ones.

Anal Gardens needs a new name and fixing lots of tile errors.

From the more competitive maps, I like adding the maps providing the complete package:
- Discovery
- Forgotten Plains
- Chernobyl
- Pitiless

*Edit: of course ShadowFiend 2 in!

I dislike adding some of the maps that play really good but are visually less appealing. Perhaps some rework could be done one these. Examples that come to mind:
- Collaboration
- Ridges
- The swamp

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MlemandPurrs
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by MlemandPurrs »

I dont think that the map pool is huge. Infact its rather small in terms of actually playable maps, it contains lots of 'fun-mode', that is any map with more than 4players, we need to expand the 1v1 arsenal as to offering a selection of maps that is relevant to competitive play for a better representation of what the ora RA mod has to offer.
That being said im opposed to removing everything we have got as this initiative doesnt necessarily have to exclude the once-in-a-while players that enjoy a team-game among friends or prefer to do a comp-stomp on large map for fun.

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MlemandPurrs
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Re: Updating RA Official Map Pool

Post by MlemandPurrs »

Sorry for the double-post, but i just wanted to add something important:
Now that we are replacing the map-pool it might be a good idea to consider about categorization. Everything getting piled up into Conquest makes a poor filtering for search.
It could be done in the form of adding player counts within a () behind the map's name, like this:
Warwind (2)
so that person that wants to play 1v1 maps filter via searching for: (2

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