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Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:44 pm
by Punsho
I've created this mod to see what it takes to make naval FUN! I've added a bunch of new naval units, revamped vanilla units in their relation to water and have modified some maps to fit in with the new mechanics. I focused on intertwining naval and ground as I think this is the path that leads to interesting and fun gameplay
Isle of Man
Isle of Man
map.png (8.27 KiB) Viewed 2886 times
Some of the changes to vanilla mechanics
  • Vehicles that became amphibious: APC, Phase Transport, Light / Tesla / Chrono Tanks, Minelayer, Harvester, MCV
  • Infantry that became amphibious: Engineer, Spy, Thief, Tanya
  • Thief can steal ships
  • All buildings can be placed on water
  • Chinook is available for all factions
  • Transport can now carry 12 infantry, 3 vehicles or 2 heavy vehicles
  • Transport cost from from 700 to 500
  • Transport removed from Soviets (added Submersible)
  • All Soviet vehicles can float on water at 20% of their speed
  • Naval Yard and Sub Pen cost decreased to 700
  • Missile Submarine Missiles track enemy units
  • Spy Plane detects submarines
  • Sonar Pulse moved to Naval Yard
  • Submarine lethality approximately halved (depth charges nerfed accordingly)
  • Gunboat cost from 500 to 300
  • Gunboat damage output changed in a way they it would have the biggest dps / second / cost out of all naval units
  • Reduced Gunboat health (just 2 rockets from a Rocket Soldier kill it)
  • Minelayer can place naval mines on water
  • And other minor changes
This mod is still missing some art assets, f.e. a jet skis for these poor fellas
Pirates
Pirates
Pirates.png (18.47 KiB) Viewed 2886 times
Maps:
Pluto https://resource.openra.net/maps/33576/
Isle of Man https://resource.openra.net/maps/33577/
Advanced Naval Wars II https://resource.openra.net/maps/33578/
Glacial Waters https://resource.openra.net/maps/33580/
Tectonic Shift https://resource.openra.net/maps/33579/
X-Lake https://resource.openra.net/maps/33581/

IMO the current best naval map for this mod is my edit of Pluto, in anyone has suggestions for what maps should be added I'll consider adding them. Sadly very few good naval maps exist, mostly because naval in Red Alert is garbage.

Incase someone wants to contribute please contact me. For those interested here's my current todo for this mod https://docs.google.com/document/d/14k7 ... sp=sharing

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:18 pm
by Graion Dilach
At a point I did a plate bib for a guy on the ORA Discord for buildings on water. Should be there somewhere.

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:46 pm
by Ronald
Again.. thanks Punsho for creating this wonderful and above all fun naval extension to the RedAlert mod.
I'v downloaded all maps and going to test in Skirmish mode (1 vrs 1 or 2vrs 2 and will provide feedback over here.

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:50 pm
by Ronald
Sadly very few good naval maps exist, mostly because naval in Red Alert is garbage.
Can you give (us) a few map-design guidelines (for others) about:
- What map design elements do make up a good OpenRA naval map?
- The DO and the DON'T when designing naval maps?

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:58 pm
by Ronald
This mod is still missing some art assets, f.e. a jet skis for these poor fellas
jetsky_concept_art.jpg
jetsky_concept_art.jpg (31.03 KiB) Viewed 2855 times
Concept art example
jetsky_blueprint.jpg
jetsky_blueprint.jpg (30.54 KiB) Viewed 2855 times
Blueprint, 3view example

If you provide a concept-sketch and/or blueprint, 3d view, I can make a 3D model in Blender for you
and render them from various camera viewpoints.

NOTE:
I do need to learn / know the steps how I can convert my 3D rendered models into 2D sprites again.

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:09 pm
by Punsho
Ronald wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:50 pm
Sadly very few good naval maps exist, mostly because naval in Red Alert is garbage.
Can you give (us) a few map-design guidelines (for others) about:
- What map design elements do make up a good OpenRA naval map?
- The DO and the DON'T when designing naval maps?
I'm not certain myself, I haven't made many naval maps nor I have meta to build around. Tho I can think of a few guidelines. When it comes to it you still need to follow basic map making guidelines. A minimum of 7 mines per player, 3 mines at spawn (2 can work on some maps). You need to have plenty of contestable objectives, some that are easy to take and guard, others that are hard, place them in such a way so you could see action in the first minutes, but also that all-ining wouldn't be the most effective strategy. You need to have open waters (around 8 cells wide at minimum) for proper naval movement, you need to have open ground (around 8 cells wide at minimum) for proper ground combat. And the list goes on. I think I've made a really good map with Pluto, it still needs refinement and includes little ground combat. But you can use it as a somewhat guideline. I've spectated a half dozen games on it, they've been pretty awesome.

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:16 pm
by Punsho
Graion Dilach wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:18 pm
At a point I did a plate bib for a guy on the ORA Discord for buildings on water. Should be there somewhere.
I found it. It's just that I want to remove bibs, not replace them with other art. I've been recommended to replace them with empty / transparent shp's but OpenRA does not seem to support them. All my methods have failed, but I feel like there's still a way

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:33 pm
by Punsho
Ronald wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:46 pm
Again.. thanks Punsho for creating this wonderful and above all fun naval extension to the RedAlert mod.
I'v downloaded all maps and going to test in Skirmish mode (1 vrs 1 or 2vrs 2 and will provide feedback over here.
Thx a lot for those kind words

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:15 pm
by Ronald
A few quick-and-dirty renders of a potential 3D JetSki model - in both Allied and Soviet colour-schemes from the above blueprint.
openra_jetsky_1_flat.jpg
openra_jetsky_1_flat.jpg (125.27 KiB) Viewed 2840 times
.
openra_jetsky_2_flat.jpg
openra_jetsky_2_flat.jpg (134.7 KiB) Viewed 2840 times
These 3D models now look a little "blocky", "sharp-edged" as in low-polygon modeling

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:16 pm
by Ronald
Same 3D Jetski model "smooth-shaded"
openra_jetsky_3_smooth.jpg
openra_jetsky_3_smooth.jpg (121.88 KiB) Viewed 2840 times
.
openra_jetsky_4_smooth.jpg
openra_jetsky_4_smooth.jpg (125.39 KiB) Viewed 2840 times

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:19 pm
by Ronald
Punsho wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:09 pm
I'm not certain myself, I haven't made many naval maps nor I have meta to build around. Tho I can think of a few guidelines.
- When it comes to it you still need to follow basic map making guidelines.
- A minimum of 7 mines per player, 3 mines at spawn (2 can work on some maps).
- You need to have plenty of contestable objectives, some that are easy to take and guard, others that are hard, place them in such a way so you could see action in the first minutes, but also that all-ining wouldn't be the most effective strategy.
- You need to have open waters (around 8 cells wide at minimum) for proper naval movement, you need to have open ground (around 8 cells wide at minimum) for proper ground combat.
And the list goes on.
I think I've made a really good map with Pluto, it still needs refinement and includes little ground combat.
But you can use it as a somewhat guideline. I've spectated a half dozen games on it, they've been pretty awesome.

Thanks for sharing your Naval Map design insights Punsho.

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:05 am
by Materianer
Have to try this map :D
Punsho wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:44 pm
This mod is still missing some art assets, f.e. a jet skis for these poor fellas
You can find a JETSKY: and some other naval stuff in this collection.
https://resource.openra.net/maps/17486/

Inserts naval units are also much awesomeness, the deployable sub and so ;)

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:14 am
by zypres1
The water after the mcv actually feel nicer than what is normal for ships...

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:56 am
by Punsho
zypres1 wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:14 am
The water after the mcv actually feel nicer than what is normal for ships...
Thx, I made that effect from torpedo bubbles

Re: Naval Revamp - A Red Alert map mod

Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 8:02 am
by Punsho
Ronald wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:15 pm
A few quick-and-dirty renders of a potential 3D JetSki model - in both Allied and Soviet colour-schemes from the above blueprint.
These 3D models now look a little "blocky", "sharp-edged" as in low-polygon modeling
Those look pretty standard, exactly what a pirate would use :P perfection. One thing is that you will need to add is a thief on top, it can be done once the model is converted to 2d but it may possibly be more work, it's you're creation after-all, make it as you please.