Snipers, Spies and the French

[Smitty]

Sorry I've just seen this happen more times than I can count. I'm pretty sure Smitty specifically intended for this thread to surround his ideas.

Eh, no worries. I'm flying out tomorrow for week long vacation so I didn't plan on being around to babysit this thread. My goal here was to get the idea and the maps out. I want to see more of the MGG change after the release before I make a poll thread.

I guess I'll phase my questions more specifically before I go:

1) Do you agree with this change?
2) Do you disagree with this change? If so, is there anything I can do to address your concerns?
3) Do you have a counter-proposal that addresses Allied faction balance within the current framework of two special units/powers per country? (And no, you can't add new nations )

Later everyone!

[Materianer]

I like the idea of the sniper drop, the british spy is really op and it is basically a bad idea to just copy a unit and make it cheaper to create a new faction.

This is lame somehow, looks like the developers either had no good ideas for england or didnt want to put too much new stuff into RA, i think the 2nd was the case.

I think we should be braver in emplementing new stuff to this game.

If it is enough tested and balanced out well why not?

What is good about a sniperdrop, that you cant just spam those snipers and let them walk with your tanks as a "destruct em all wave" this was a problem when they was buildable once.

P.S. we should not kill each new idea from scratch @SoScared
Your ideas are often implemented fast for some reasons ( maybe because you are the famous streaming guy )
If you say no to something you form the meaning of many of your followers.
So you should treat others ideas fairly imo

@Minotaur dont give up so fast with your new stuff, the best way for you to realise it is creating a map with your changes.
This is a bunch of work but can be realised if you are willing to do that.

This versatility makes this game so great.

If your map is fun to play then and makes sense you can pull more players on your side.

[Sire]

While I will miss the British Spy from a casual standpoint, I do not mind if it was replaced with the British Sniper Drop (or simply just being able to train Snipers like Tesla Troopers, either at T2 with the Radar Dome or T3 with the Tech Center).

If the cloak is an issue for the Sniper, then can one simply remove the cloak and always have the Sniper revealed? Why are Snipers cloaked in the first place? It's not like Artillery or V2 Rockets are cloaked. (Granted, if Snipers remain "limited and elite", maybe they can keep the cloak. I do not know if they are permanently cloaked or reveal themselves when firing.)

However, as for moving the Phase Transport to France (and Mobile Gap Generator to England), while it makes sense from a gameplay standpoint, a part of me does not want England to lose out on the Phase Transport and wants to keep France with their Gap Generators and Fake Structures.

Instead, I would like France to deepen their "Deception" technology. Perhaps in addition to the Mobile Gap Generator, France also upgraded their stationary Gap Generator, covering more area or requiring less power. For Fake Structures, I would love to see "fake timers" for the Fake Missile Silo, Fake Chronosphere, and Fake Tech Center. So, if there are two Missile Silos up and one is a fake, the player does not know which one is real and what timer to actually look out for. Bonus points for actually being able to launch a fake missile, perform a fake chronoshift, and launch a fake satellite to further play mindgames with the opposition.

This way, this Allies will have this for their traits.

England: Stealth [From Espionage, if Snipers remain cloaked.]
- Special Ability: British Sniper Drop [Replacing British Spy]
- Special Unit: Phase Transport

France: Deception
- Special Ability: Fake Structures (and Fake Superweapons)
- Special Units: Mobile Gap Generator, French Gap Generator

Germany: Technology
- Special Ability: Advanced Chronoshift
- Special Unit: Chronotank

* * * * *

The concern with the "fake superweapons" is UI Clutter, especially in larger games with multiple people playing as France. This can be minimized by limiting such structures to just one, but then that reduces the effectiveness of placing multiple fakes to confuse the enemy.

Then, if France also gets "upgraded Gap Generators" in addition to their Mobile Gap Generators, then they will be the only faction to technically have "three traits" instead of two.

- - - - -

If I may go off-topic and go crazy for a moment, what if stationary Gap Generators also affect the accuracy of incoming Artillery and V2 Rockets? We know such units will always target the middle of the artificial shroud, so Gap Generators can act as "siege Radar Jammers" in the fact that they may divert incoming fire away from their location. This way, while siege units can still try to take out the Gap Generator, it is far more efficient to charge into the darkness and destroy it proper with Infantry and Tanks.

However, Gap Generators already have the change that they actively reduce unit vision in the official playtest, so I am unsure if they need another "buff."

[SoScared]

P.S. we should not kill each new idea from scratch @SoScared.

You misunderstood. The gif was 100% a statement of support. Further it seems it helped bring the discussion back on topic.

I'd never shut down discussions of new ideas and as far as I remember never have.

[Chimpo]

I think spies would be even more OP if more players actually knew their full range of abilities. I am doing tutorial and am a little loathe to tell people about them,

For me their are plenty of mini nerfs for spies that could be trialled eg, very close to enemy infantry = detection, more sniff range for doggies, detection is permanent, tanya can detect spies etc etc

[Raishiwi]

I like this change. I would go from playing England to Allies if they were balanced. One step closer to playing as any!

[Blackened]

I think this idea is certainly worth exploring further.

I also think you outlined the major issues this addition would cause but I'd like to add the lack of stable soviet vision providers as another reason for possible imbalance. it takes 5 seconds for a sniper to recloak and that really isn't a lot of time for a soviet player to hunt it down.

If this were to be added I think changes to the sniper are necessary.