Lets discuss Shock Troopers (Red Alert)
A discussion of thoughts and feelings about shock trooper
- Murto the Ray
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:34 pm
Lets discuss Shock Troopers (Red Alert)
Hello all! For two releases now, shock troopers have been buffed a considerable amount to make them more usable in the current multiplayer environment. It seems as though shock trooper massing has become a popular way to play for a large number of players. Whilst i do not object to a buff being given to Shock Troopers i do object to the way that this has changed the game.
I feel like making shock troopers a useful unit has, in turn, made many more units now useless. Would you ever use tanks against someone who is using shock troopers? Defenses get torn through, infantry massacred and planes shot down before they can do much damage by the flak trucks that accompany them. Ukraine is now useless in SvS matches.
Well, that's my opinion at least. I'm not going to be the one deciding whether shock troopers do need a nerf. Please post your own opinions below and select an option in the poll.
Will be away for a couple of weeks so will probably not be able to respond.
I feel like making shock troopers a useful unit has, in turn, made many more units now useless. Would you ever use tanks against someone who is using shock troopers? Defenses get torn through, infantry massacred and planes shot down before they can do much damage by the flak trucks that accompany them. Ukraine is now useless in SvS matches.
Well, that's my opinion at least. I'm not going to be the one deciding whether shock troopers do need a nerf. Please post your own opinions below and select an option in the poll.
Will be away for a couple of weeks so will probably not be able to respond.
The unit is awesome, but a tad powerful in bulk.
If large groups of Shock Troopers had tended to randomly explode or attacked very slowly, that might help things quite a bit. There could be some risk in moving hordes of Shock Troopers around. If they go nearby Tesla Coils, major electrical storm? If you store them inside an APC, the APC shorts out and won't drive anymore.
If you CAN get 25 Shock Troopers to the enemy's base, it's game over. But getting them there is a HUGE gamble requiring an enemy who isn't paying attention.. .
Shock Troopers can't defend against dogs?
end random thoughts...
If large groups of Shock Troopers had tended to randomly explode or attacked very slowly, that might help things quite a bit. There could be some risk in moving hordes of Shock Troopers around. If they go nearby Tesla Coils, major electrical storm? If you store them inside an APC, the APC shorts out and won't drive anymore.
If you CAN get 25 Shock Troopers to the enemy's base, it's game over. But getting them there is a HUGE gamble requiring an enemy who isn't paying attention.. .
Shock Troopers can't defend against dogs?
end random thoughts...
- Murto the Ray
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:34 pm
I like this idea, but we will see what others sayzoidyberg wrote: ↑
If large groups of Shock Troopers had tended to randomly explode
I think their damage is fine, seeing as they are supposed to be a lategame high-performance unit. The real problem with them is their resilience to damage. If anything, I'd give them a health nerf, because currently, only Tanya or mass hinds can deal with them. We should shift their role towards second-row damage dealers that rely on Heavies to take the brunt of the damage.
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- Murto the Ray
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:34 pm
they were buffed because they were previously mostly useless.
simple solution: nerf them, but not to the extend that they're again as bad as before. I think they were mostly buffed in terms of having a more effective weapon (range, possibly sighting range, damage output).
don't like cost or health nerfs and the "lets have them explode when in Group hurr-durr joke already got old when it ruined Grenadiers.
simple solution: nerf them, but not to the extend that they're again as bad as before. I think they were mostly buffed in terms of having a more effective weapon (range, possibly sighting range, damage output).
don't like cost or health nerfs and the "lets have them explode when in Group hurr-durr joke already got old when it ruined Grenadiers.
- Prince Blueblood
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I for one will choose to NOT NERF the Shock Troopers, they are fine as they are is.
Yes, their rolling electrical stinging balls of death are resilient to most assault except...
Massed Artilleries, seriously guys, I didn't speak about 3 / 4 arty being able to handle like a horde of 40 shock troopers, but I talk about 8 or more artys with proper rocket soldier and longbow supports.
They are resilient and they have flaks? THat's the point of having balanced army!
But still, it's finally nice to see Soviet faction actually become truly viable late game, who finally pushed the lategame metagame into one balanced thing between Allies and one soviet instead of one Allied instawin with GPS + Artys.
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IMHO, the Russians are fine as there is, no need to nerf them.
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It's the Ukrainians that are too weak, Demo Truck is just too long to build and often not worth it
Yes, their rolling electrical stinging balls of death are resilient to most assault except...
Massed Artilleries, seriously guys, I didn't speak about 3 / 4 arty being able to handle like a horde of 40 shock troopers, but I talk about 8 or more artys with proper rocket soldier and longbow supports.
They are resilient and they have flaks? THat's the point of having balanced army!
But still, it's finally nice to see Soviet faction actually become truly viable late game, who finally pushed the lategame metagame into one balanced thing between Allies and one soviet instead of one Allied instawin with GPS + Artys.
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IMHO, the Russians are fine as there is, no need to nerf them.
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It's the Ukrainians that are too weak, Demo Truck is just too long to build and often not worth it
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I don't have a strong opinion on this one, but.. Isn't it possible to nerf something just a bit? E.g.: damage -3% instead of -10%. Or: damage -2% AND cost +$10.
Also I still hope for a more objective way to test the strength of factions. By checking winpercentage for 1v1 games perhaps? Internally (in a faction) things could also be balanced. If grenadiers are never built, but rocket soldiers always, then +1 grenadiers AND -1 rocket soldiers.
Also I still hope for a more objective way to test the strength of factions. By checking winpercentage for 1v1 games perhaps? Internally (in a faction) things could also be balanced. If grenadiers are never built, but rocket soldiers always, then +1 grenadiers AND -1 rocket soldiers.
- Murto the Ray
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:34 pm
Perhaps arty should have to fix their position before firing so that they cant run?Prince Blueblood wrote: ↑Massed Artilleries, seriously guys, I didn't speak about 3 / 4 arty being able to handle like a horde of 40 shock troopers, but I talk about 8 or more artys with proper rocket soldier and longbow supports.
- Prince Blueblood
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Sure, Ukrainians have hard time to deal with them, but it shouldn't end up as a call to Nerf the Russians' toys, because they are belong to late game changer and their massed nature fits perfectly into the soviet playstyle.christian wrote: ↑They are definitely too good as they are now so something should be done with them and yes they are particularily hard to deal with as Ukraine.
Maybe it's the Ukrainians who need some boosts who also able them to stand toe to toe against the lategame allies. Demolition truck is again, too much situational and often too weak against even some sacrifical riflemen.
There's no need to do that, IMHO, current Russians are balanced enough to stand toe to toe against lategame AlliesMurto the Ray wrote: ↑Perhaps arty should have to fix their position before firing so that they cant run?Prince Blueblood wrote: ↑Massed Artilleries, seriously guys, I didn't speak about 3 / 4 arty being able to handle like a horde of 40 shock troopers, but I talk about 8 or more artys with proper rocket soldier and longbow supports.
OpenRA Nicks :
- Everything with "Blueblood" inside
- Yuelang (when I speak Chinese, literally)
My Ping might be Red... blame distance and my shitty connection due to which country I lived in...
- Everything with "Blueblood" inside
- Yuelang (when I speak Chinese, literally)
My Ping might be Red... blame distance and my shitty connection due to which country I lived in...