[RA] [Modded Maps] SoS Playtest v1.6

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Tue Apr 18, 2017 7:07 pm

@3.Lucian: Agreed but keep in mind that the price/production time went down 25% (400 to 300). The nerf pulls the unit more towards a late tech anti-infantry than an all-rounder killeverything unit with the 50% damage cut on heavy armor and 25% damage cut towards buildings.

It's a very late addition so it would have to function particularly well in order to be considered at a later date.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 3:23 pm

All right, added the War Factory 50% cap with 4 structures (100, 75, 60, 50) which I consider to be one of the most unpredictable additions on the list. As with the Shock Trooper, Dog and the MiG HP buff this will likely be scrapped fast if it shows any early signs of weakness. Worth the try.

With that I believe the playtest maps should be distributed shortly.

AoAGeneral1 · Post by **AoAGeneral1** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:52 pm

Not entirely sure on the spy change. Unit veterancy is extremely strong and limiting it to British only could make the British side a lot stronger in this regard.

Shocktroopers im slightly impartial on but stuck with the idea that dropping the 1000 damage vs none is a problem.

Medics HP nerf could be a need but in RA96 you could toy with this idea that they don't heal 100% but instead can heal 80%.

Dogs: Check on their attack animation and give the devs a friendly reminder to have this fixed. This would become a much stronger unit then they currently are.

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Ideas:

Spy into construction yard? - Reveals what they are building through out the game if scouted.
Spy into barracks and war factory? - Reveals what they are building through out the game if scouted. (Can have this applied to British spies)

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:19 am

Unleashed the beast - 51 maps added to the resource site w v1.6a.

For convenience sake here are some .zip map pack downloads:

1v1/FFA: https://www.dropbox.com/s/zwomgh6iduo1ew2 (25 maps)
Teams: https://www.dropbox.com/s/18qwur45d63r7b3 (26 maps)
Everything: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pakvh40cwdgnq3 (51 maps)

Printer · Post by **Printer** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:04 pm

SoScared wrote: ↑ Unleashed the beast - 51 maps added to the resource site w v1.6a.

For convenience sake here are some .zip map pack downloads:

1v1/FFA: https://www.dropbox.com/s/zwomgh6iduo1ew2 (25 maps)
Teams: https://www.dropbox.com/s/18qwur45d63r7b3 (26 maps)
Everything: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pakvh40cwdgnq3 (51 maps)

Am I the only one not able to download the pack? Checked different browsers and still not able.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 10:15 pm

Google Chrome gives me a general error message.

Did you try Firefox? That works for me at least. If not I'll find somewhere else to host the files.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Mon May 01, 2017 12:18 am

Seemed to have been a problem with the urls. Updated. Should work now for all browsers.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Mon May 01, 2017 9:36 am

Fixed NavalYard/SubPen targetable bug with revisions. Map Pack links updated.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Thu May 04, 2017 12:43 pm

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Sun May 14, 2017 6:02 pm

First exposure of the Civilian Forward Command, on a new revision of Agenda:

http://resource.openra.net/maps/21269/ *updated to revision 6

Lorrydriver · Post by **Lorrydriver** » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:33 am

I like most of the changes, but the MCV movement speed decrease really just slows the game down, and also takes a lot of options away. For instance: On a lot of maps I feel like its now mandatory to take certain expansion spots to not fall behind in economy, for example on behind the veil it's no longer viable to go for corner expansions first because your MCV is gonna be there late. I guess that change is mainly to nerf basepushing, but for the sake of the game, that should be achieved in a different way.

Regarding the forward commands: I think they are a really cool idea, however I noticed on Interference, that the map itself restricts the usefulness of those forward commands, reason being: To have a economy that supports radar tech, you'll have to have built at least 5 ore refineries, due to the low amount of ore available per field, those take a lot of time to build, and therefore make it harder for you to actually go for the radar tech.

OMnom · Post by **OMnom** » Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:10 am

Lorrydriver wrote: ↑I like most of the changes, but the MCV movement speed decrease really just slows the game down, and also takes a lot of options away. For instance: On a lot of maps I feel like its now mandatory to take certain expansion spots to not fall behind in economy, for example on behind the veil it's no longer viable to go for corner expansions first because your MCV is gonna be there late. I guess that change is mainly to nerf basepushing, but for the sake of the game, that should be achieved in a different way.

Regarding the forward commands: I think they are a really cool idea, however I noticed on Interference, that the map itself restricts the usefulness of those forward commands, reason being: To have a economy that supports radar tech, you'll have to have built at least 5 ore refineries, due to the low amount of ore available per field, those take a lot of time to build, and therefore make it harder for you to actually go for the radar tech.

Seconded. Altering the speed of the MCV doesn't change the game, just the speed at which it progresses. If you still want to keep it, I suggest moving it to 80, finding a way to speed the pace of the game back up and add more options. I'm currently experimenting with a 75 speed MCV and significant tech buffs to see if its a valid way to divert the course of the basepushing river.

Forward command posts are a good idea, but I think the map design has to accommodate it; I don't think forcing vision centers/forward commands onto preexisting maps is representative of what they could accomplish.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:38 am

Interesting points on the MCV speed.

I won't be able to follow this thread too much the next couple of weeks but at least I should mention the altered playtest maps with the civilian structures are basically test labs and was added more in the spirit of 'let's see what happens' than genuinely trying to improve the maps.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:11 am

All right, back on the horse again.

So things are developing a bit differently then expected, the HitShape/Unit Stance playtest pretty much paves the way forward with some potential for the mod to deal with RA's balance in different ways. For this reason I've held off on putting together the next version until some time after the official playtest has been out for a few weeks. Depending on how players experience the playtest, the map playtest may simply have to adjust thereafter.

For the official playtest I pitched a few changes more or less non-intrusive with the core of the game, at least according to the map playtests themselves:

https://github.com/OpenRA/OpenRA/pull/13640
https://github.com/OpenRA/OpenRA/pull/13669

With that the focus moves over to the official playtest for the time being.

SoScared · Post by **SoScared** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 2:56 pm

Just an afterword on the MCV speed reduction being included despite concerns being brought up in this thread.

What I came to learn, that which was experienced by the above with the reduction of the MCV speed mentioned in this thread wasn't derived out of this particular playtest series but rather out from other users playtest maps such as Smitty's own series (e.g. link) which includes variables of the same change coupled with other changes. This doesn't mean the observation of the effect of the MCV change wasn't correct in an isolated case but with the gameplay of playtest series 1.6b being experienced as noticeably faster and more action driven compared to the 0527 release I chose to trust that experience which so far allowed me to accurately predict the outcome of the balance changes presented in my PRs. A possibility could be that the experienced slow-down effect was drowned out by other changes, which isn't unreasonable given the vast amount of tweaks and turns but regardless, the reward and satisfaction of seeing careless and cheap MCV pushes being punished on a regular basis made it an irresistible inclusion with the following balance patch.

I'm sorry I didn't take the time to follow up on my reasoning with this decision but the past couple of months being as they were made me less active on sharing the reasoning with my final decisions.

I'm confident that besides the MCV speed change being experienced as uncomfortably slow by some users it will ultimately reward RA's gameplay many times over, as promised. In any case, time will be the final decider.