Units affected by damage

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Materianer
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Units affected by damage

Post by Materianer » Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:40 pm

What do you think about a small slowdown for units wich are damaged?

This is something from the original game, but i dont know wich units was affected and how much reduction it was.
Maybe the reloadtime was a bit longer too i dont know, would be nice if someone can tell me how it was in RA.

I tested the speedreductions a bit and found out that you have to be carefully with it.

theoretical:
Nerfing damaged tanks too much could make them insignificant.
Infantry would be not more so easy crushable and defenses are stronger through that change.
Player who repair theyr units would benefit a bit more from this so repairpad usage, mechanics and medis are a bit better.
Mcv is easier huntable.
The mammoth self healing makes them lower affected by this.
The gameplay diversity is enlarged a bit, with different speeds its looking a bit more realistic if an army is moving.
Its not always the same if one unit hunts another for example.

So i created a modmap with following changes:
medium damaged units have a reduction on speed by 10%
heavy damaged get -20%
For airunits i chose only 5 and 10% more would look a bit strange and airunitbalance is a fragile thing.
You have a checkbox in lobby options to mark damaged units blue just to see wich units are slower.
https://resource.openra.net/maps/30140/

Would be nice with unit specific nerfs for example rangenerf for the arty, lower chronoradius for chronotanks and so on but that is not so easy doable i think.

camundahl
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by camundahl » Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:37 pm

I think this was in RA2 and TS, not sure about original RA, but it would be a cool change even if it was even lower percentages. I also think heavily damaged units should continue to smoke.

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anjew
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by anjew » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:41 am

theoretically this already happens to infantry as they go prone

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netnazgul
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by netnazgul » Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:42 am

Such a change will further increase the infantry meta if implemented, so needs to be counter-balanced if we don't want that.

camundahl
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by camundahl » Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:31 pm

Maybe just like a 5% or less reduction on heavy damage plus constant smoke. Infantry meta is fine, they are high risk/reward. It would also make it easier to pick out tanks to send back maybe, or for the other players to target the smoking vehicles.

I'm really happy with the current RA mod balance, but i love seeing little details like this.

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Materianer
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by Materianer » Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:56 am

Okay i uploaded 2 maps with following nerfs.

https://resource.openra.net/maps/30163/ -Dynamite Cliff-DNM
https://resource.openra.net/maps/30164/ -Tournament Island DNM

-5% speed for medium damaged and -10% for heavy damaged units.

After over an hour of testing how that would influence the unitspeeds i must say in many cases there is no speedreduction.

For the fast units i tested like the lighttank, ranger, apc or flaktruck there will be only a reduction on heavy damagestate.

then there are units like the chrono and teslatank wich got a reduction on only the first damagestep.

For some units all 3 units have different speeds, that seem to be the case for slower units.

I think the reason for that is because the speedreduction is in % and there are not so many different speeds.

It would be nice to know how that works with the speeds, at wich number will a units be faster ?

netnazgul wrote:
Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:42 am
Such a change will further increase the infantry meta if implemented, so needs to be counter-balanced if we don't want that.
Yes thats true and thats one reason why i don't really like a simple speedreduction on all units.
Some units are more affected by such a nerf because the speed is part of theyr strength, especially the lighttank, apc but the other scoutingunits too.

I found out that there are traits for some unitstats so its easy to nerf the following attributes.
ReloadDelay
Inaccuracy
Firepower
Range
I will work out a modmap but this will take a while because every unit should be adjusted for its own and maybe also defense structures should get theyr own small nerf to make it fair.

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netnazgul
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by netnazgul » Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:15 pm

Does the multiplier you use stack properly with the terrain speed modifier? Because AFAIR a vehicle has it's 100% speed on roads only and reduced speed on terrain/rough. Maybe it gets replaced instead of further multiplied?

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Materianer
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Re: Units affected by damage

Post by Materianer » Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:41 pm

netnazgul wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 3:15 pm
Does the multiplier you use stack properly with the terrain speed modifier? Because AFAIR a vehicle has it's 100% speed on roads only and reduced speed on terrain/rough. Maybe it gets replaced instead of further multiplied?
https://github.com/OpenRA/OpenRA/wiki/T ... multiplier
Thats the trait i'm using
Materianer wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:56 am
For the fast units i tested like the lighttank, ranger, apc or flaktruck there will be only a reduction on heavy damagestate.

then there are units like the chrono and teslatank wich got a reduction on only the first damagestep.

For some units all 3 units have different speeds, that seem to be the case for slower units.
Okay i made a testmap with roads and have following results for roads now.

Fast units all have the same speed, yes a strange thing hehe

chrono and teslatank have the speedreduction on the second damagestep, the medium tank behave the same and heavytank has 3 different speeds.

The slow units still have the 3 different speeds like the heavytank.

This is a bit weird i don't know whats going on with this.
Maybe speedreductions like -6 and -12 or -7 and -14 would work better but i dont wanna put more work in the unitspeeds anymore hehe
I will test the other mltiplier traits how they will work.
something like a combined nerf system would be nice like the first damage step makes a speednerf 2nd a longer reload delay, of course cutted for each unit then and only slight changes.
The hardest thing will maybe be to have a recognizable change with these traits wich will not influence the gameplay too much.

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