Playtest Discussion

Playtest 20180102

Discussion about the game and its default mods.
Murto the Ray
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Playtest Discussion

Post by Murto the Ray » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:36 pm

Download: LINK
Changelog: LINK
News Post: LINK

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Happy New Year Everyone!
2018 brings another playtest, and what a playtest it is! With the number of changes in the hundreds it is truly titantic.
I've done my best to include the changes that will facilitate the most discussion but there are still many more changes that affect visuals, modding and more!
A huge thanks to all the developers that made this happen!

The changes affecting gameplay for this playtest are:

General:
  • Fixed dead vehicle husks disappearing when a player surrenders. [#13276]
    Vehicle husks don't disappear if the owner surrenders.
  • Fixed units and buildings failing to render in some cases when at the edge of the screen. [#13899, #14398, #14473, #14482, #14509]
    Units and buildings will now always render at the edge of the screen.
  • Added hotkeys for the observer statistics panels. [#13781]
    The statistics panel can now be controlled using hotkeys.
  • Added 'Enable debug commands in replays' option under advanced settings. [#13818]
    Visual debug commands may now be used during replays.
  • Added a server list tab to the multiplayer lobby. [#14599]
    The server list may now be viewed from within a server.
  • Removed the ingame IRC Global Chat. [#14496]
    The ingame IRC has been removed.
AI:
  • Fixed the AI treating naval units as if they were ground based. [#13609]
    AI now give naval units special treatment.
  • Fixed the AI building more structures of certain types than it should. [#14025]
    AI no longer spams structures it shouldn't.
  • Fixed the AI ignoring the shroud targeting superweapons. [#14492]
    AI will no longer fire superweapons at units & structures it cannot see.
  • Improved "Attack or Flee" decision logic. [#14466, #14468]
    AI now have better engagement capabilities.
Red Alert:
  • Fixed unarmed units being able to gain veterancy via crates. [#14125]
    Unarmed units can no longer gain veterancy via crates.
  • Fixed Chronoshifting an actor multiple times overriding the original return location. [#14155]
    Units will always chronoshift back to their original location if chronoshifted multiple times.
  • Fixed submarine sensor targeting. [#14198]
    Submarines now auto-target submerged enemy subs when detected by sensors.
  • Fixed Supply Trucks being able to target Gap Generators, and not Chronospheres. [#14269]
    Supply Trucks may now enter Chronospheres and but not Gap Generators.
  • Fixed engineers not being able to capture buildings from certain angles. [#14539]
    Engineers may now capture buildings from all angles (fixes the Service Depot capture bug).
  • Fixed civilians not panicking when coming out of a destroyed building. [#14601]
    Civilians now panic when coming out of a destroyed building.
  • Fixed blocked enemy units being produced when an enemy factory is captured. [#14220]
    Blocked enemy units are no longer produced if an enemy factory is captured.
  • Added unique GPS indicators for Communications Center and Forward Command. [#14274]
    The Communications Center and Forward Command now have their own unique GPS indicators.
  • Added notification when paratroopers land. [#14161]
    The "Reinforcments arrived" notification now plays when paratroopers land.
  • Added more lobby options. [#14209, #14417, #14363, #14590, #14567]
    "Limit ConYard Area", "Kill Bounties" and "Redeployable MCVs" are now lobby options.
  • Scaled health and damage. [#14301]
    All health and damage amounts have been scaled by 100 to reduce calculation errors
  • Reduced damage to structures from exploding barrels. [#14314]
    Structures now take less damage from exploding barrels.
  • Units no longer target units revealed by the GPS satellite. [#14117]
    Units no longer target units revealed by the GPS satellite.
  • Disabled Tesla Coils no longer detect stealthed units. [#14370]
    Stealthed units are no longer revealed by disabled tesla coils.
  • Gunboat and Submarine are now available at Low tech level. [#14188]
    You can now build gunboats and submarines at Low tech level.
  • Improved Soviet faction crate bonuses to match Allies. [#14204]
    Added flak trucks and apcs to the possible units a crate can give, added engineer to the soviet heavy infantry squad crate reward.
  • Reduced Pillbox damage versus light armour. [#14244]
    Pillboxes now do 10% less damage to light armoured targets.
  • Light Tank weapon changed. [#14471]
    Light Tank damage versus wood increased by 10%. Reload delay reduced from 22 to 21.
  • Arty and V2 minimum range increased. [#14471]
    Minimum range of Artillery and V2 Rocket Launcher increased to 5 cells.
  • Grenadier explosion behaviour changed. [#14471]
    Grenadiers now always explode on death but with reduced damage.
  • Pillbox power increased. [#14471]
    Pillbox and Camo Pillbox power consumption increased to 20 from 15.
  • Fake building destruction threshold improved. [#14471]
    Fake Building destruction threshold improved from 90% to 70%.
  • Mig damage vs Heavy increased. [#14471]
    MiG damage versus Heavy increased by 15%. HP increased to 75 from 70.
  • Cruiser and Missile Sub range increased. [#14471]
    Cruiser and Missile Sub range increased from 16 cells to 20.
  • Cruiser accuracy increased. [#14471]
    Cruiser inaccuracy decreased from 2c938 to 1c938.
  • Missile sub accuracy increased. [#14471]
    Missile Sub inaccuracy reduced by 80%.
  • Depth Charge speed increased. [#14471]
    Depth Charge speed increased from 85 to 125.
  • Submarine vision increased. [#14471]
    Submarine vision increased to 8 cells.
Tiberian Dawn:
  • Fixed tileset pathability issues. [#14413]
    Fixed unit pathability of "north-facing" cliffs on tilesets other than desert.
  • Added more lobby options. [#14209, #14567]
    Added "Limit ConYard Area" and "Redeployable MCVs" lobby options.
  • Stealth detection behaviour changes. [#14368]
    Advanced base defenses and Communcation Center / Temple of Nod no longer detect stealth while low power.
  • Scaled health and damage. [#14448]
    All unit heath and damage amounts have been scaled by 100 to reduce calculation errors.
Dune 2000
  • Fixed MCV and Harvester being able to gain veterancy via crates. [#14125]
    MCV and Harvester can no longer gain veterancy via crates.
  • Improved selection box sizes for several buildings. [#14405]
    Starport, IX Research Center and Repair Pad have had their selection boxes enlarged to their proper size.
  • Added additional maps from the original game. [#14512, #14514, #14515, #14516, #14517, #14518, #14519, #14520, #14521, #14522]
    Cave of Riches, Chin Rock, Gara Kulon, OH Gap, Jacarutu, Mount Irulan, The Minor Erg, Red Chasm, Halleck's Ridge and Tenaya have been added to the map pool.
  • Removed most cloak/uncloak sounds. [#13872]
    Removed most cloak/uncloak sounds to match original D2k.
  • Building upgrades no longer require a Construction Yard. [#14433]
    Building upgrades no longer require a Construction Yard.
  • Scaled health and damage. [#14461]
    All unit heath and damage amounts have been scaled by 10 to reduce calculation errors.
As always, please keep discussions constructive and on topic!
Last edited by Murto the Ray on Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

STUKA
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Post by STUKA » Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:17 pm

Why is Global Chat GONE? :(
Also, the chat sound seems much louder than it used to be. Tuning down 'Sound' in the audio section does not make it less loud, nor does video do this. I find it quite annoying that guns and explosions get overtuned by the chat sound

camundahl
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Post by camundahl » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:22 pm

All the Red Alert changes look great!

And if anyone is still worried about Soviet naval, maybe they will get a flak boat one day.


Can a submerged sub shoot another submerged sub without surfacing?

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netnazgul
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Post by netnazgul » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:44 pm

@STUKA global chat was too undermaintained and became a garbage pile, only seldom used as game advertising platform. New server UI replaces its usecase somewhat with player names shown to the left and also on hovering the server playercount.

Some further updates are in brainstorm phase AFAIK

Pawonashi
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Upgrades in D2K Campaign

Post by Pawonashi » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:19 pm

I didn't notice it before, but in the campaign in the second Harkonnen mission (specifically 2a) after building Barracks upgrades become available. You can upgrade Construction Yard, Barracks and Light Factory, but these upgrades give nothing. I assume that these aren't supposed to be available at this point at all...

I've checked second missions for other factions and the problem is present for them, too. Can you disable upgrades in some missions just like some structures and units?

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MustaphaTR
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Re: Upgrades in D2K Campaign

Post by MustaphaTR » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:46 am

Pawonashi wrote: I didn't notice it before, but in the campaign in the second Harkonnen mission (specifically 2a) after building Barracks upgrades become available. You can upgrade Construction Yard, Barracks and Light Factory, but these upgrades give nothing. I assume that these aren't supposed to be available at this point at all...

I've checked second missions for other factions and the problem is present for them, too. Can you disable upgrades in some missions just like some structures and units?
On it.

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Materianer
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Post by Materianer » Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:14 am

Okay here is my opinion after some days of testings:

I like most of the changes, especially the new checkboxes will bring more variably to this game, what is really good because you have now some options to change the game without changing it too much.

Kill bounties checkbox will have a very small effect to the gameplay but to the optics and maybe reduce the lag a bit.

The no redeployable mcv checkbox makes rushes a bit more dangerous because you can flee anymore, so make enough defenses and a wall around your mainbase.
Also the mcv wander around and spread buildings strat is blocked and maybe reduces close baserushes or even makes them more risky.

No more buildradius checkbox is the most funny one for my personally as i'm still a bit nostalgic. this option may let the game end fast if the team is working good together, teamplay is much more important with this turned on.

The AI mostly also seem to perform a bit better even if it still on newbie level imo

Now is time for some critics on the RA balance changes ;

1. Pillboxes okay some people still seem to think that they are a bit too strong so give them another small nerf even if i think this is not needed the change is small and okay for me.

2. Migs 15% damage increase might be a bit too much because harvesters have heavy armor you need 2 salves from 2 migs to kill one now, a bit more armor is justified and good.
I would say reduce the damage increase a bit and give a bit more armor would be a better way. Btw the Longbow seem to be the only a bit underperforming airunit now.

3. Lighttanks are a bit stronger thats a dangerous unit to touch especially because they are a spamming unit a small damage increase can have a large impact, lets hope the best and that RA is not too similar to TD with this change in the future.

4. Grenadiers are also a tinderbox touched here, even if they still seem to die fast if the defending enemy has some protection for his base, they die a bit later and mostly not all at once like they did before, what could lead to many fast ended and annoyed players.
Last release i made some weeks always naders-apc-takticks when i played soviets and ruined many games with that. They are already op imo but underused because most players dont know how to use them right.
I would say the explosion damage spread should be a bit increased or and the explosiondamage.

5. Artys last and most important point for me. The fact that they dont target enemys units and buildings under shroud already makes them much weaker but reducing the minimum range to 5 cells in same step is just makeing a very much overrated unit too weak.
Of course the changes are also done to V2 but doesnt weak them as much as artys because they are usally diffrently used ( snipe and run a good tactic for them )
Also the behavior is just a strange thing now a lighttank or flaktruck is driving into theyr direction and they drive around like stupid.

All in all a big present for soviet players despite of the lighttank buff, uhm maybe the lt buff is needed after thinking about it allies are the new nod now. ( rush or die )
( Or at least it was like this a few releases ago in TD i think AoA already fixed this i think )

Nah i overstate a bit hopefully :D

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netnazgul
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Post by netnazgul » Sat Jan 06, 2018 4:14 pm

2. Migs 15% damage increase might be a bit too much because harvesters have heavy armor you need 2 salves from 2 migs to kill one now, a bit more armor is justified and good.
I would say reduce the damage increase a bit and give a bit more armor would be a better way. Btw the Longbow seem to be the only a bit underperforming airunit now.
You do understand that you need to spend quite a lot of time microing $4000 worth of migs to kill a single harvester? And one placed AA gun kills all that in a moment.
The fact that they dont target enemys units and buildings under shroud already makes them much weaker
they don't AUTO target, but you still can ctrl+click arties into the shroud. Previously they were fully autonomous and could even kill units that should be hardcounter (flaks and light tanks). Now arties are fully isolated when they are not backed up by support, because their vision is smaller than their minimum range. Scoutillery is killed by infantry now.

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Materianer
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Post by Materianer » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:06 pm

netnazgul wrote: You do understand that you need to spend quite a lot of time microing $4000 worth of migs to kill a single harvester? And one placed AA gun kills all that in a moment.
Yes i know they are expensive and flying around and sniping things can be time consuming, just felt like the damage output is a bit too strong now and a skilled mig pilot will of course not fly into an allies basearea. Ore trucks are mostly out of aa range but that depends on wich map is played.
My opinion is that the problem with migs is not the damage they deal its the fragility what makes them suck.
netnazgul wrote: they don't AUTO target, but you still can ctrl+click arties into the shroud. Previously they were fully autonomous and could even kill units that should be hardcounter (flaks and light tanks).
Yes thats what i meant that they are much weaker just by that change now, you need more time now to shoot into the shroud what is even harder for lower skilled and new players. New players also could be confused by theyr driving back if the unit they aim comes closer than 5 cells, thats a really strange thing imo.

Another few words about 3. Lighttanks this is a change wich gives the germans a bit more advantage than france and england because you can now fill the empty chrono slots with lighttanks. Just tested it with a superchrono full of lt you can kill the war factory and the mainbase now. Not really a problem but makes the germans stronger versus the other allies factions than they already are.

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netnazgul
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Post by netnazgul » Sun Jan 07, 2018 4:43 pm

well, GPS update was done exactly to nerf Arties (and thus Allies as a whole) being OP and Allies vs Allies games becoming stale when both have GPS up.
As for the 5 cell min range - it is done to prevent artillery/v2 units from killing incoming vehicles that are supposed to counter them - they just turn too fast, run too fast and hit too hard. Now you absolutely need to support long-range units with mobile defence (rockets, infantry, tanks) so that they are not sniped by air or ground attacks.

weeman
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Post by weeman » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:36 pm

has the shell map music been optioned to disable?

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IronScion
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Post by IronScion » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:03 am

Finding it interesting that after so much pushback against additional option checkboxes for the last few releases, the devs have gone the nuclear option and implemented some of the most contentious ones!
"Each denomination in the new series of banknotes will feature a different species of Australian wattle" - Mint Spokesman

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anjew
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Post by anjew » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:23 am

IronScion wrote: Finding it interesting that after so much pushback against additional option checkboxes for the last few releases, the devs have gone the nuclear option and implemented some of the most contentious ones!
I've never really seen this as a bad thing. Id even like the options being the same cross mod. So I think adding a bounty option to TD isn't such a bad idea.

Its pretty much the equivalent of mutators/gamemodes which was well received in this thread
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avalach21
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Post by avalach21 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:10 pm

anjew wrote:
IronScion wrote: Finding it interesting that after so much pushback against additional option checkboxes for the last few releases, the devs have gone the nuclear option and implemented some of the most contentious ones!
I've never really seen this as a bad thing. Id even like the options being the same cross mod. So I think adding a bounty option to TD isn't such a bad idea.

Its pretty much the equivalent of mutators/gamemodes which was well received in this thread
it's good to have options :-)

camundahl
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Post by camundahl » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:13 pm

I like the bounty option because I'm not fond of the RPG style text popping up.

I wish the dead bodies and husks stayed longer.

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