TS actually happening, balance changes?

Discussion about the game and its default mods.
epice
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:39 am

TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by epice » Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:06 pm

So now that Tiberian Sun looks like its actually happening. Shall we discuss what, if any, balance changes should be implemented?
Things that are bugs but should they be fixed or kept? (rail guns and flames colliding with slopes)

GDI being able to build a component tower with turret on it already.
Hover MLRS more effective VS infantry.
Will the Orca Transport effect balance?
Should the Carryall be replaced with the Dropship? Should the Dropship even be normally buildable and able to carry vehicles?
Can we make Jumpjet infantry useful for something besides a early game scout?
Disc Throwers, should they be allowed to force-fire and increase their range or not?
Should Nod artillery be more effective against infantry?

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BaronOfStuff
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Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 7:25 pm

Re: TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by BaronOfStuff » Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:50 pm

epicelite wrote: Disc Throwers
Can we please make these fit into the 'not shit' category?

PersianImmortal
Posts: 157
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:04 am

Re: TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by PersianImmortal » Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:40 pm

epicelite wrote: So now that Tiberian Sun looks like its actually happening. Shall we discuss what, if any, balance changes should be implemented?
Things that are bugs but should they be fixed or kept? (rail guns and flames colliding with slopes)

GDI being able to build a component tower with turret on it already.
Hover MLRS more effective VS infantry.
Will the Orca Transport effect balance?
Should the Carryall be replaced with the Dropship? Should the Dropship even be normally buildable and able to carry vehicles?
Can we make Jumpjet infantry useful for something besides a early game scout?
Disc Throwers, should they be allowed to force-fire and increase their range or not?
Should Nod artillery be more effective against infantry?
MLRS doesnt need an infantry buff. It's the GDI's anti air vehicle.

epice
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:39 am

Re: TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by epice » Mon Aug 26, 2013 11:23 am

PersianImmortal wrote: MLRS doesnt need an infantry buff. It's the GDI's anti air vehicle.
HOW DARE SOMETHING HAVE MORE THEN ONE PURPOSE!

Matt
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 12:21 pm
Location: Germany

Post by Matt » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:01 pm

I have only played the single-player campaign, but the original Tiberian Sun unit composition seems to be very problematic. The engineer is an instant capture unit and Nod has an underground APC. I won most single-player missions very early by trolling the AI player with hostile take overs.

MrTweek
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Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:54 am

Post by MrTweek » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:23 pm

They should first implement the Game "as-is" and then thy should think about the Balancing... day-night switches and so on =(

epice
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:39 am

Post by epice » Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:00 pm

Cmd. Matt wrote: I have only played the single-player campaign, but the original Tiberian Sun unit composition seems to be very problematic. The engineer is an instant capture unit and Nod has an underground APC. I won most single-player missions very early by trolling the AI player with hostile take overs.
Well in multiplayer people just spam Titans to win, or spam Disruptor+Carryalls super early game somehow.

Like I barely just got my war factory up and a group of fucking carryalls land in my base and drop a bunch of fucking disruptor, what the fuck?

Your supposed to build pavement to stop Nod's subterranean vehicles. OH IMPROVEMENT IDEA! Make it so you can place pavement beneath buildings so you don't end up with a hole when one gets blown up. That would be a welcomed change.

Devils tongues were pretty useless because infantry only had to stand on a slope to be invulnerable against them, and in large groups they damage each other.

I would always filled up sub APC's with Cyborgs and send them all at once into my enemies base. Then again, I usually played against AI because everyone in multiplayer just spams X thing to win. I never really had too huge of a problem with base walking in TS now that I think about it. It did happen but it wasn't in every game you played like in openRA.

What I would like to see actually, is TS turned into a game that requires strategy and not "spam X to win".

Put a build limit on fucking EVERYTHING.

reaperrr
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Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 3:35 pm

Post by reaperrr » Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:40 pm

MrTweek wrote: They should first implement the Game "as-is" and then thy should think about the Balancing...
That would only make some sense if the mod was primarily aimed at singleplayer, which is likely not the case.
The original balance is just a big pile of goo, and couldn't be replicated properly anyway without replicating some bugs and other atrocities WW committed. I wouldn't bother with it too much.
PersianImmortal wrote: MLRS doesnt need an infantry buff. It's the GDI's anti air vehicle.
Plus it can move over water, and has higher firing range and speed than a titan, making it better at hit & run tactics as well as flanking the opponent.
epicelite wrote: What I would like to see actually, is TS turned into a game that requires strategy and not "spam X to win".

Put a build limit on fucking EVERYTHING.
Build limits are cheap, and would kill variety of tactics and playing styles.

I'd rather make the rock, paper, scissors more pronounced. An army of Titans without support should stand no chance against an army of bazooka infantry, for example (the latter is way too weak in the original).

There are some more things that need to be kept in mind:
1) Generally speaking, weapons in TS were FAR to accurate, because if they landed less than X distance away from the target, the projectile would 'snap' onto the target and deal full damage with no spread penalty. Bikes were probably the only ground unit able to evade an artillery shell at full speed. This obviously shouldn't be replicated, it was annoying as hell anyway.
For example, originally the artillery was actually great against infantry. Instead of fixing that ridiculous accuracy, they just nerfed damage in multiplayer :roll:

PersianImmortal
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Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:04 am

Re: TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by PersianImmortal » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:56 am

epicelite wrote:
PersianImmortal wrote: MLRS doesnt need an infantry buff. It's the GDI's anti air vehicle.
HOW DARE SOMETHING HAVE MORE THEN ONE PURPOSE!
Why buff something that doesn't need a buff? What would the point of wolverines be after that?

epice
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:39 am

Re: TS actually happening, balance changes?

Post by epice » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:13 pm

PersianImmortal wrote:
epicelite wrote:
PersianImmortal wrote: MLRS doesnt need an infantry buff. It's the GDI's anti air vehicle.
HOW DARE SOMETHING HAVE MORE THEN ONE PURPOSE!
Why buff something that doesn't need a buff? What would the point of wolverines be after that?
Their cheaper and available at a lower tech level. (and should be allowed to be loaded into infantry transports.)

MrTweek
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:54 am

Post by MrTweek » Wed Aug 28, 2013 1:53 pm

Hmm in this Case:

Code: Select all

Devils tongues were pretty useless because infantry only had to stand on a slope to be invulnerable against them, and in large groups they damage each other.
that worse/is a very angry Bug xD but everyone had used it :D

maybe the Developers of OpenRA can fix that "bug", for example... the Flames can go across the Slopes =/

sillyflip
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:48 am

Post by sillyflip » Thu Aug 29, 2013 5:24 pm

A few changes I would like to see
  • JumpJets should be able to toggle between flight mode and walking. This will make them easier to use.
  • Give the carryall the ability to auto-pickup harvesters, bring them to their refineries and return the harvester back to the tiberium field. The code could then be reused for the Dune mod.
  • Remove the GDI Tech Center and Replace it with the GDI Upgrade Center.
  • Make the Orca Transport buildable for GDI but not the Dropship.
  • Give GDI and Nod their own version of the Light Infantry; maybe use community art from PPM?
  • When over water the Hover MLRS shouldn’t sink during an ion storm.

epice
Posts: 174
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:39 am

Post by epice » Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:31 pm

sillyflip wrote: [*]Remove the GDI Tech Center and Replace it with the GDI Upgrade Center.
[/list]
Replace the GDI Radar with the upgradeable radar/advanced comm center(whatever you like to call it). Keep the tech center but remove the upgrade center. Super weapon upgrades can then be just placed on the Radar.

I'm pretty sure it has completed graphics, I've seen it in mods but maybe it was made for those mods?

sillyflip
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:48 am

Post by sillyflip » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:41 pm

epicelite wrote: Replace the GDI Radar with the upgradeable radar/advanced comm center(whatever you like to call it).
That was the beta Radar Station. I think art but not the buildup animation is still in the tibsun mix file.

xondak
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:33 pm

REPLY

Post by xondak » Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:38 am

I'd like to see a new feature implemented. Since we're probably gonna get an RA2 mod at some point, I'd like to see garrisoned buildings made available in Tiberian Sun. You wouldn't need fancy garrisoned graphics, just maybe a pallet swap to the player's colors.

What do you guys think?

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